In light of the worldwide protests sparked by the murder of George Floyd at the hands of Minneapolis police, and the subsequent energized Black Lives Matter movement (#Black Lives Matter/#BLM), NiteLife Exchange has renewed its own commitment to social justice and equality. NLE stands by Black Lives Matter and is proud to provide this platform of expression and advocacy for change.
He’s an actor, dancer, singer and choreographer, and to add to his talents, DeWitt Fleming Jr. is also an accomplished drummer/percussionist. His abilities as a tapper have been widely praised. Fleming has danced as a soloist with the Lincoln Center Jazz Orchestra, the Princeton Symphony Orchestra, Vince Giordano and the Nighthawks, and with artist such as Wynton Marsalis, Bobby McFerrin, Marvin Hamlisch, Christian McBride, Bobby Sanabria and Wycliffe Gordon, among others. As a choreographer his work has been seen on “Boardwalk Empire” and more, including The New Jersey Symphany Orchestra, at the Kennedy Center in Washington DC, and at the Spoleto Festival in North Carolina. As a percussionist, Fleming has performed in session work, live shows, and musical theater. Additionally, he is a host/MC, appearing at venues such as NYC Summerstage, Symphony Space, BB King’s Times Square, and various pop up outdoor events throughout the city. Fleming is also an educator and teacher of dance.
NiteLife Exchange (NLE) asks DeWitt Fleming Jr. (DF) Six Questions:
NLE: As a starting point, we’d like to examine the systemic roots of racism, beginning with the economics of the slave trade feeding colonial European development. This model persists in the white patriarchy, predatory capitalism, and what Cornel West calls the “gangsterization” of America. Thus, racist ideas derive from policies and will continue to exist as long as these policies exist. What will it take to really reform this system that hits Blacks the hardest?
DF: First, I think we have to examine two things: one, the economics of it, and two, the image of African Americans. Slavery was accepted worldwide for so long partly becasue slave owners were able to paint an image of the African that made most, for lack of a better word, “ok” with the atrocities Africans endured for so long. Savages that needed severe “guidance”—they are physically superior and can be a great workforce with the proper “guidance,” for example. Within this image, there is an element of fear that is introduced early on because of the sheer strength and size of the African. These Images are still very present today. This image is one of the key components to what we are dealing with. Most of the world has been taught for hundreds of years to fear what we now call black people, mainly black men.
Another image that was introduced was the image of a person void of intellect and incapable of being, what the colonizers considered, a “civilized human being.” Later, to many, the colonizers were seen as good-hearted people trying to make a “civilized human being” out of these savages. Through this yet another image is introduced early on, “The White Savior.” This idea is still a very common tool used in all mediums, and most skillfully in Disney movies. So we begin to learn these images and ideas early on as children. Many white people believe black people can’t succeed without their “guidance,” and many black people believe they can’t succeed without white people. Subsequently the ability to be in control of the global image of the African American is what has always. and will continue to be. one of the reasons injustices and atrocities are inflicted on the African American—aka black people—perpetuated by the image of the good hearted “White Savior.” This subconsciously makes some white people feel as though it is their duty to control and/or guide black people indefinitely. I have only begun to scratch the surface on this subject.
The colonizers/slave owners knew that this image was imperative for the success of their businesses. After all, who has a heart for a savage? So here you have the beginning of the controlling of the image of the African American for financial gain. This will shape and shift many times over hundreds of years, but for the sake of time I’ll jump to today. It is no secret that the America we live in now is heavily controlled by corporations and the wealthy. All who have gained their success from the free labor of the African American slave and also the controlling of the image of the African American, whether indirectly or directly. Agan, this image has been shaped and shifted many times; however, what has endured over time is the fear of the African American. With this fear, actions that may seem absurd when acted upon white people, somehow don’t seem that absurd when acted upon black people. This is why many stand by silent. I won’t go into all of the ways this fear is used to generate wealth, but the biggest one is our prison system.
How do we begin to change it? I think there is a lot to do, but I will offer two suggestions. For starters, I think we really have to start to look at where we spend our money. Look at the companies and corporations you support. Look at their boards. Look at the other companies they hire or are in business with. What organizations do they donate to? Do they use prison labor or hire a company that uses prison labor? Do they donate to police departments in cities with a high black population? Follow their money. A lot of these companies aren’t hiding their practices because they believe this image of black people has been maturing for hundreds of years and is here to stay. Don’t pay attention to what they do on their social media in a time where #blacklivesmatter is so PC. FOLLOW THEIR MONEY! Next we have to stop supporting these companies that profit—directly or indirectly—from not only the injustices towards black people, but also the controlling of negative images of black people. If we all did this collectively, then we can start to make way for change.
Secondly we have to start supporting black businesses. This is the only way we can start to shift the image of black people in this country and around the world. By supporting black businesses you are allowing black people to create their own image for themselves. This is something we have never been able to consistently do. I think these are two great places to start.
NLE: Recent thinking identifies the deeply ingrained human notion of tribalism (us vs them) as an overarching, problematic world view and a contributing factor of racism. Is there more that can be/should be done beyond education of the “you have to be carefully taught” mode?
DF: I think fear plays a huge part in this. As stated, many have been taught to fear black people whether they realize it or not. I think first we have to allow ourselves to examine our feelings when they happen, as they are happening. Too often we act on our feelings before we truly understand what they are. I think TV and movies really are the catalyst for this. From the movie Birth of a Nation to the TV show “Different Strokes.” I can’t tell you how many times someone white has said to me “What you talking about Willis” and then begin to talk “jive” to me as if they are making me feel comfortable, or more like making themselves comfortable. Many are guilty of this white, black, and everyones else. We tend to deal with each other in a preconceived way. We completely disregard truly how we are feeling at that moment, much less who we are dealing with. When we do this, we deprive ourselves of actually experiencing the individual standing in front of us. Our actions and interactions become pre-scripted and calculated. I often have to consciously ask myself why I’m feeling a certain way about someone I don’t even know. More often than not, the conclusion is because of something I saw, read or heard. I try to deal with that mentally, and work my way through it to allow me to experience the individual in front of me and not manipulate the situation into what I already preconceived.
I know that sounds like a lot, but our brains move fast, and all of that can happen literally in a second or two. It’s not so much educating yourself about a group of people; it’s more like educating yourself in human interaction. In relation to racism, whether they realize it or not, white people are often taught how to deal with black people, further removing black people from their humanity. Like the black imaging I was speaking of earlier, this has shaped and shifted for hundreds of years. White people are seldom taught to deal with black people the same way they deal with other white people. Of course we are all taught to treat others like you would want to be treated. However, that controlling image of black people has taught white people that black people need to be treated differently. I think the first step is realizing that this systematic imaging exists. Once we realize it exists, we can then begin to remove it from our lens as we walk though the world allowing us to experience individuals and not images. I do believe this is happening, and I have experienced this prior to our current state of affairs. Not very often or in many places, but I have experienced it.
NLE: Is unity within the Black community (internecine bias) a factor? If so, what can be done from within and without to level the playing field?
DF: I think once again the issue is the removal of the black person’s humanity. Say I put 10 people of one race in a room, other than black. They all come from different backgrounds, different economic status and different mental health stabilities. Then I deprive them all of food, warmth and other basic human needs. They all would have different ways of dealing with their situation. Some would agree, some wouldn’t. Some would go to extremes; some would be more rational. But who’s to say which is rational and which is extreme? Some may say what seemed extreme, in hindsight, was rational because it got them out of their current situation, or vice versa. The point is, all of this is human behavior. A human’s first instinct is survival, and we all, as humans, have different ideas of how to survive. Yes, as black people at times we have had to collectively agree on one survival tactic, even though it went against our personal survival tactic, but there were still those who’s humanity would not allow them to conform. Coming together for the greater good is a tactic often done by a minority group. However, again because of the controlling imaging of black people, our humanity is often overlooked. We are humans like everyone else. If you take a look a little closer, you will see an internecine trait is a human trait, not a black trait. With that trait, the playing field IS level. It’s like that reckless sibling who brings the family together.
NLE: People outside the Black community can be well-meaning but unaware of certain behaviors or uneducated about how they can help make a difference toward authentic equality. What do these folks need to understand the most?
DF: I think my answers to questions 1 and 2 are very important to understanding the answer to this one.
NLE: Will the Black Lives Matter movement stick this time? Why or why not?
DF: The Black Lives Matter Movement is nothing new. It has always been here. It just has another name now, and has more evidence thanks to phone cameras, a greater media presence and social media; there’s a less likely chance for the evidence to be “lost” because of the immediacy and reach of the internet. I hope it does stick, so much that I hope all of those opposers get what they want in that eventually All Lives WILL matter.
NLE: What are your thoughts about being an artist of color and your role in working toward justice and equality for Blacks and ultimately for all?
DF: Things will get better for me as an artist of color once things get better for black people in general. Art is ultimately a reflection of life and until the controlling imaging of black people stops, the opportunities and image of the black artist can only go but so far. There has been a big push for color blind casting and putting people of color in roles that are traditionally white. However, very seldom do they get it right. For the sake of not interrupting the audience’s conditioned imaging, they dehumanize an entire cast instead of humanizing the few actors of color in traditionally white roles.
As artists we have a unique ability to interact with people of all races, backgrounds, economic status and beliefs. With that ability I feel comes a great responsibility. The more you perform the more you realize how vulnerable an audience can be. What you do, or don’t do, can alter someone’s life forever. My life was changed at a young age because of theater. I’ve seen older people’s lives changed because of theater, even the elderly. With that knowledge I try to make sure that my performance/message is honest, truthful, human and authentic. I try to achieve excellence, and educate. I then try to go out of my way to meet with audiences after the show. I want them to know that I am a real person. I want them to experience me as a human being because at this moment their defenses are down. Everyones knows that artists are treated differently, and though this comes with its own stereotypes, I try to use this unique opportunity to my advantage in hopes that it will affect the way they treat the next person they encounter that looks like me. I believe small personal reinforcements like this is what can, and will, lead to change. I know I have done my job when the audience leaves that theater questioning everything they believe to be true. Especially when those beliefs are related to people that look like me.
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